BY MIKE CETERA
At the conclusion of last week's live virtual town hall meeting on underage drinking, we promised that the experts who participated in the forum would reply to the unanswered questions.
Angela Halvorson of TopLine Professional Strategies, which is a consultant to the Illinois Alcoholism and Drug Dependence Association, has authored a response. Please find her answers after the jump.
Thanks again to everyone who participated in the chat. We believe it was a successful jumpstart to what should be an ongoing conversation about alcohol use among teens.
It seems that a continuation of viewing underage drinking as a law enforcement problem is not going to be productive. A great many of the comments seem to suggest that involving law enforcement and harsher penalties will solve things. But, isn't fear of punishment what leads many kids to not contact parents or other adults when they might really need their help?
Posted by: Tom | February 11, 2008 08:59 PM
You are correct in saying that it is often fear of punishment that results in kids driving after they have been drinking, hoping that parents or other adults will not find out. However, it is also a belief that they will suffer no serious consequences from law enforcement or other adults if they do drink. In many cases it is simple hubris: believing they are invincible and nothing bad will ever happen to them. Obviously, the safety of a young person is tantamount in every situation. If a young person has been drinking then getting that person home safely is the most important thing. While laws and policies are not the panacea to the underage drinking problem, it is certainly a part of the solution. There must be a community-wide effort, open communication and consistent and fair enforcement of underage drinking laws in order to prevent needless deaths as a result of underage drinking. Without question, laws and enforcement must be applied as a part of the solution but so must community-wide communication and education. Parents must communicate with each other, with teachers and with their kids.
I think we have to get back to the basics of thinking "it takes a Village . . . ". Everyone is SO afraid of saying something about a child to another parent. When I was younger (which in all honesty was NOT that long ago) if we did something wrong we were either corrected by the adult who was present and they told our parents (double whammy). Why are we all afraid to "butt-in"??
Posted by: Lisa | February 11, 2008 09:08 PM
It is difficult to say why people are afraid to do what many people feel is “butt in” to other people’s business. This would be a question better answered by the community. What is important however is that the community recognizes that it takes the whole community (village) to keep youth safe.
A response to Shelly Muser's posting: Can I infer from your comment that you consider teenagers who drink alcohol to be substance abusers? Can a teenager use alcohol and other drugs without being an abuser? Should drug education programs be abstinence only programs as most are for sex education?
Posted by: Tom | February 11, 2008 09:09 PM
Underage drinking and all drug use are illegal. So yes, youth who drink and anyone who uses illicit substances are abusing alcohol and other drugs. Drug and alcohol education programs are and should be abstinence based programs because the consumption of those substances is illegal.I think we need to listen much more carefully to those who have recently lived through the period of adolescence and can reflect on it with some degree of recency. One such person posted anonymously at 8:59 PM and who said "from what i understand, the students who died have friends that are drinking and driving in their honor alomst every weekend." The poster referred to it as stupid, but what motivates such behavior> Posted by: Tom | February 11, 2008 09:17 PM
What motivates such behavior? This is the most important question of this discussion. Why do youth, particularly those youth who have lost friends to drinking and driving, drink and drive? This question would best be answered by someone who does it. Is it an attempt to alleviate the pain of loss of friends? Is it because they believe everyone else is doing it? Is it because they think it is cool or something they are supposed to do? Is it because of peer pressure? Is it to cope with stress? There are as many reasons for doing it as there are people acting this way. The only person who can answer that question is someone who is doing it. However, what can be said in response to your question is that whatever the reason, drinking is not the answer.
Always the same old thing -- more parental involvement, more marches, more programs. What we have not done is look at what makes us different than other countries, and why this is so. Europe lets teens drink at age 16, some younger than that I believe. They grow up with alcohol & therefore learn their limits. They learn their tolerances. Moreover, alcohol is not a taboo or forbidden fruit there. Forbidden fruit is always sweeter. I think it is the affiliation with conservative religion that has made the problem here. It links back to Prohibition, and even down to the tradition of liquor sales on Sunday.
My child spent some time in France this summer. The only drunks running around were the American ones, seeing as Mommy & Daddy's prying eyes were miles away. The French kids viewed them as morons. Why? See above.
I also fail to understand why my kid can: sign her life away for an exorbitant student loan, power a speeding missile they call an automobile, fly an aircraft, and even be trained to be a hired killer with a rifle in her hand to "defend" our country, yet she can't have a cold beer with her parents at a restaurant!
One additional comment: I also think that teens here are bored to tears. What can they really do out here in the sticks? It is pathetic that they are reduced to hanging out in the Walmart parking lot & actually cheer the opening of the new Kohl's to hang out there. If you are not interested in high school sports, and in particular are not male, there is precious little for you to do. And guess what, naieve folks, they apparently are NOT studying the Bible, the police blotter proves that.
I also see that every time the "community" focuses on family, it is always for the youngsters. As if teens are not in anyone's family! When was the last time you heard or read about anything being brought in for this population? It is always Little League, Pee Wee Football, a new daycare center. Communities are reaping what they have sown. They magically forget their teens once they grow out of these activities & then they wonder how it all went wrong. Let's consider this group the next time some planning commission decides they need another activity or shop, etc. in their neighborhood. It sure beats them stealing meth out of some farmer's field!
Wow. So to whom does the responsibility fall to to stimulate and engage a "bored" teenager? NOT the community. The community didn't conceive and give birth to these human beings. It's not the community's fault that too many parents don't live up to their responsibility and obligation to raising their own children. Parents are responsible for identifying what their children's interests and talents are, not the community. It is up to the parents to provide the opportunity to develop those interests, wherever and however that may be. Yes, that means effort is required. If someone's teenager is so bored that the only thing for them to do is to celebrate the newest store opening, as Kathy suggests, then I'd say that that someone is an extremely LAZY parent. There are plenty of academic clubs to join in the high schools. There are plenty of places to volunteer idol time. If that doesn't float a teenager's boat then they can get a job. There are constructive and rewarding alternatives to sports. Sometimes you have to look instead of waiting for something to fall in your lap. All this energy and time spent blaming the government, schools, community services and anyone else but the family is such a waste. Spend it on your kidz!!!!!!
***VERY LONG, BUT MIGHT HELP SOME TO UNDERSTAND***
I read some of the comments above and saw that one question was what does someone who is still young think about underage drinking and then drinking and driving. As still a teen, drinking is sort of just something you do if you want to. It's usually at most parties. Why did I choose to drink during high school? I chose this because it was an experience. I chose to because it was there at parties. I chose to though, I was never pressured. I was fortunate to not have been. I did for the first time before my junior year. Before that I had been at parties and chose not to. Although I know it is illegal, to tell the truth, almost every high school student does it or has done it. Even the smartest, most athletic, most proper students have done it. That description is supposed to mean that most do no matter who they are. From my knowledge, this has been going on since the 60's. This does not make it right at all though,nor does it justify it, I was just trying to maybe bring that to everyone's attention. I choose to drink still occasionally on the weekends, at parties with friends. I believe,though that I do this very responsibly, as do my friends. When we choose to drink we make sure either we stay where we are going to be drinking or we make sure we have a designated driver. We have fun but are careful.Now someone may say, well you are still doing something illegal. That is very true, and to be honest I think about it and try and find someway to justify it. I think though that yeah it is illegal but not everything that is legal should be and vice versa. Some 30 year olds should not drink and some 19 year olds like myself are more responsible about it than they are. Again, this does not make it right. All I can really say, and I do hate to say it because maybe someone might interpret this wrong but it's going to happen; I truly believe it will never stop. It's just something that happens. Just as we all think premarital sex is not good, we are now giving contraceptives to young kids and teaching safe sex now more than abstinence. That does not mean we want young people to have sex, we are not promoting it. We just know that,well, we can't stop it. So we have to help there be more responsibility when doing it. Now this is my point about underage drinking: I don't believe it will stop and can be stopped, I believe though that it can be taught to be more responsible. That doesn't mean that we say oh do it but be careful necessarily. It means to not say that drinking is not to just get trashed and look stupid and throw up like in movies. It means to have fun then, but if you want to do something more adult, then act like an adult. Now-a-days kids know things younger than I remember I did. They want to grow up faster. They think that drinking means "Yeah let's go get drunk!" I think that is stupid. But that's just me. After what happened last year, I knew that I would never forget about it. That I will always remember that date. It made me so sad to hear that these young kids drank that much to have made the decision to get in a car with that many people. It made me sad that an adult could have thought to take that responsibility. So many things were done wrong that night by those kids, by the driver, and by the people throwing the party. Could this event have been prevented? Yes and No. If one of those kids would have said hey I'll be designated driver. Or I'm not gonna drink a lot or any at all to make sure we are all ok. One of them had to have thought, why the heck are we all going to get in a car with this stranger and with so many people? And then that's where it comes up where if the kids thought the parents would have picked them up, maybe they would have called them. Who knows. But now we need to take action and I'm glad they are trying to do this. Although I said I do still drink underage I don't drink and drive nor do I let anyone, if I see them. I read in a magazine about a town somewhere where they have a number kids or anyone can call on weekends and volunteers will go and pick them up. I thought this was awesome. Teens and parents volunteer to go and pick up anyone if they are close enough, and they go and drive them to a safe destination. This can help to prevent everyone from drinking and driving. Also, i hate to say it but its true, stronger punishment for underage drinking and also for dui's will definitely help. I choose not to drink sometimes if I think the party might have the cops come. Either way something needs to be done. None of us want what happened last year to happen in anyway, to anybody. Hopefully this will help a bit to understand the minds of a teenager, or well at least one.
As a parent, I have managed to raise two children, both of whom have chosen not to drink. One is in his sophomore year at college (and still choosing not to drink despite the abundance of opportunities to do that in college) and the other is in her senior year in high school. Both have had fun all through high school (and college now) and have not needed alcohol for it. Of course alcohol use (appropriate use and the abuse) has been a topic in our home and the appropriate use has been modeled by us since they were very young.
One of the things we have always done for our kids is provide a home that they and their friends actually want to hang out in. We finished the basement before our son hit high school, complete with video game systems, a great TV and DVD player and sound system. We bought a ping pong table and foosball table. We stocked the basement with a few board games. We welcome their friends to hang out at our house. We talk to their friends when they come over, ask about what they are up to and how they are doing, show an interest in them. We aren't friends to them, we are their friend's parents and adults that actually care about them. We make it a point to touch base with every friend who comes into our home to hang out. We have always been clear that there are rules in our home that are to be respected. We keep a refrigerator stocked with juice and soda in the basement that they kids are welcome to. They also know that if my husband or I want a soda, we will come down to get one. From the laughter and noise that is in our basement, I can tell these teens are having fun without alcohol.
There are plenty of things for teenagers to do that do not involve drinking. First of all, there is nothing wrong with having a party with friends, just leave alcohol out of the situation. Play some music or video games, dance, mingle, act silly. If you like sports, go to your high school sporting events for entertainment. Go bowling with a group of friends. Even if you aren't into bowling, you'll have fun because of the people you are with. Go to the movies, or better yet, rent a few movies and have your own movie marathon. Play games. Trivial Pursuit or Cranium can be fun with a large group.
Best of all, you'll actually remember what you did and everything that happened!
To OHS grad:
I appreciate your comments. I can identify with your views because when I was in my teens I thought and handled things much the same way as you do. I'm the parent of three teenagers. Knowing what I did as a kid and not having very much parental involvement back then has definitely impacted how I am choosing to raise my kids. I agree with you, I don't think these things can be stopped. I just think that it happens more often as a direct result of poor parenting. You seem to be very thoughtful and mature and I'd be interested to know what you think regarding parental responsibility.
To the nineteen year old that left the comment above. You could have summed it up by just saying "Im going to justify my behavior". You brain isn't completely formed until age 24 or later ( new brain studies). You drink, you damage some developing brain cells. The difference between you and that 30 year old is that he/she is fully developed. I'm thinking this has more to do with the age of consent for you children, then the actual act for starters. It's getting away with something and it's mind altering. It's a drug... plain and simple. It will cause a young person to become addicted to alcohol at a much younger age than an adult because as your brain is still developing. You are creating a "Need" situation as the brain idenified this stimulus as necessary. Have you ever spoken with an adult alcoholic in treatment? (I have counseled a few). They are often mentally and emotionally stunted teenagers due to alcohol. First drug of choice to almost all addicts.....alcohol. I'm not trying to scare you sraight I'm telling you the way it is. To the parent who wants to have a cold one with their kid...... grow up if you still can. The rate of alcoholism in Europe is not less they have more public transit and less drug driving deaths that is all.To the parents of bored teens let them get a job and contribute to their college fund!Volunteer in the community. Kids just don't feel useful these days.
***TO WHOM IT MAY CONCERN AND THE PERSON ABOVE***Before you pass judgement on me you should know that I am completely aware of the consequences of drinking both physiologically and psychologically. I know that it kills brain cells I'm also aware of well everything you had stated above. And don't worry you are not scaring me, I am actually extremely intelligent and well then maybe you would say then I am stupid for choosing to drink alcohol SOMETIMES! I do not drink all the time and I know for a fact that I will never become addicted. You can say what you want but I know I won't. I'm also very aware of alcoholism in my life because much of my family has it. Again someone can say well then you are ten times more succeptible physiologically to become addicted to alcohol. I know this. But I assure you, I have known and experienced from my family the early signs and what can and will happen. And it's not happening to me. All I was trying to say was give a point of view because no matter what more than half of high school students do it and again I never said it was right or good. And it is completely true that if a young teen starts drinking now many are going to become addicted I can see it now with some of my peers. It's sad but I know that I can control it. Anyways again that's all i wanted to point out. I don't need counseling and I know that in ten, twenty, and thirty years I will be a succesful nurse getting my masters maybe going back for a social work degree and will definitely not be an alcoholic. To Susan, honestly I am scared to death thinking about what I will do when I have kids. I just know that I will teach them to talk to me not be afraid but also teach them the dangers of drinking and well to everything. But I can assure you I wouldnt want them to drink but then I will remember my teen years. So I have no clue what I would do, but I have time now to think about it. And to clarify to some inquiring minds...my mom and dad now know that I choose to drink sometimes. I don't keep it a secret and my mom does not like it but she knows that I am responsible enough not to make a stupid decision and my dad he doesnt really like it but he remembers how it was when he was younger and the best advice he gives me is to be safe and careful about it. So those are my thoughts...don't know if it helps.
And to the mother above whose kids choose not to drink...I think that is awesome and they are unique and don't care what their peers may think. I choose to, but I think it's great that they don't want to.
to anon. maybe kids feel the need to drink and act "grown up" because of your "new brain study" statistic. i'd like to see where you got that information. also i would like to say that just because you read something on the internet (or anywhere else for that matter) does not mean its true. a lot of so called "facts' are flying around on this thing, with no sources. i can tell you, that in the academic world, your statement would be considered purely opinion.
on that note, in my opinion a 30 year old could be just as underdeveloped as a 19 year old. and vice versa. life is not a straight line, as some like to imagine. there are so many factors that go into 'developing' a mind (for lack of a better word). if you think you are not learning new things or learning from your mistakes after the age of 30 or 24 i feel very very sorry for you. of course i only have personal experience to back this up. i mean, how can we measure individual growth without taking into account ALL of the things that have happened to us and all of the people we have come in contact with in our lives? everything we learn right down to the simple 2+2=4 has an effect on our psyche.
i'm no brain scientist, but is science really that easy???? especially BRAIN science?
i'm not expecting you to agree with me, i just want to make sure that this girl knows there are people out there who do not judge her based solely on her age or her "underdeveloped" state. and that i applaud her responsibility and thoughtfulness on the subject, considering many 30 year old "developed" minds dont think twice about getting behind the wheel while intoxicated.
also, maybe the kids YOU come in contact with don't feel "useful" because you tell them that they are still developing. maybe they feel a need to drink and act "grown up" because they feel infantilized by you. just a suggestion. maybe if alcohol wasn't such a forbidden fruit it wouldn't be so tempting to some.
also, i think the person who made the reference about europe was trying to say that kids there are taught at a VERY young age to respect alcohol. which leads to less abuse of it. i would like to see your quoted statistic though, because i have never heard of such a study.
everyone really needs to open their minds a little bit if they are going to make any sort of progress with this problem.
I lost my little brother last May after a night of binge drinking. He had just turned 20 years old. It has been devastating. It has also been quite an educational experience for me. I am 21 years older than he was. After his death I wanted to understand what had happened. I surfed Facebook and Myspace and still just cannot believe what kids out there are doing.
My little brother Griffen made an extremely bad choice and that cost him his life. The kids around him made bad choices too. After he passed out they took permanent marker and wrote all over him. It wasn't smiley faces and mustaches, it was penises and sexual innuendos. One of the remarks was indicative of sexual assault. He woke up and was very angry. He was made to leave the party and his "friend" supposedly drove him home. According to this "friend", he left Griffen with the vehicle and keys. Griffen wound up dead about a half mile from home outside the passenger side of the vehicle. His BAC was .267.
We have a terrible problem occurring with our youth. When I was younger people drank but not to get wasted. When someone got drunk they were taken care of. Today's youth have graduated from going out and drinking to going out getting plastered and then degrading and humiliating each other. This behavior can be deadly. It cost Griffen his life.
Since his death I have learned it is a "game" to write on the first person who passes out. I find the entire writing on drunk passed out people reprehensible. Most of our youth and some adults even, do not. TEA BAG ME was written on my brother's chest. I thought that must mean some girl did something to Griffen. I Googled the term and was shocked at what it meant.
Teabagging is used to punish and humiliate the weakest drinker, boy or girl. The boys drop their pants and dip their testicles in and out of the face or mouth of the passed out victim. The "friends" claim Griffen was not teabagged it was all just a joke. That joke helped to cost my little brother his life.
To everyone out there I say that we as a society need to recognize this is a community issue and step up and do something about it. It doesn't matter how well you raise your child this could happen to anyone. A kid could be a first time drinker and pass out and find themselves in a position they are not prepared for. I saw a slogan recently which said something like trying to hold youth solely accountable for drinking is like blaming a fish for dying in polluted waters. Isn't that the truth?
I have taken up way too much of your space. Please go to www.griffensgift.com and read the entire story.
I think that it is great that people are talking about the problems in Oswego,But can we please have the meeting our kids need help now! Come on everyone it is our responsibility as adults to do this.Remember positive energy ,lets act now! Please please please
More questions answered is the heading,Ready here we go as a spokesperson for the youth {self appointed after all i am an adult} can someone who cares and has the authority please and i say please tell us when is the meeting!? I am now begging for the kids,and please if nobody has the time just say so and i will do everything that i can to have the meeting!Please be positive and remember this is and should be top priority in our town !